Typology: Women and the Church
Posted by Andrew Wencl in Bible & Theology, Church & Missions
The blogosphere is the worst place for a reasoned debate. You lack the ability to see and pick up on non-verbal cues from your challenger, it depersonalizes him, and it is easy to miss his point or the thrust of his argument.
I like to read Tim Challies’ blog. He provides links to other blogs and news articles that are usually fresh, interesting, or funny. A couple weeks ago he linked to a blog article that attempts to interpret the following passage:
“Let a woman learn quietly with all submissiveness. I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve; and Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and became a transgressor. Yet she will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith and love and holiness, with self-control.” (1 Timothy 2:11–15, ESV)
This had the potential for debate. So I bit.
Mary Kassian is a dear sister in Christ. She has written books, studied theology, and teaches at the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary in Louisville, Kentucky. She’s a complementarian, so it’s hard to believe she could take a stance on a subject relating to this passage that I’d disagree with.
Since our discussion in the comments section came to a halt pretty quick when neither of us wanted to budge, I thought it appropriate to lay out key segments of her argument here and voice my concerns though this medium. You might benefit from reading her article before what follows, since you might take it differently than I did.
Based on Typology
Mary’s conclusions stem from her understanding of typology. That’s a fancy word for the study of divine foreshadowing in the Bible. It is very similar to allegory except it doesn’t deny the historical reality of the type, and it speaks of a greater fulfillment in the antitype (the foreshadowed object).
Jesus saw Jonah’s time in the fish as a type of His own burial and resurrection (antitype). Matthew saw the Exodus as a type of Jesus’ childhood escape to and from that country (antitype). These examples might seem to suggest that almost any connection we can make between two events in the Bible form a type/antitype relationship. My goal here is not to establish a framework for determining if or when a type/antitype relationship exists, but to determine if Paul is intentionally asserting a type/antitype relationship in 1 Timothy 2:11-15, and if so, what that relationship is.
Adam, Eve, Christ, and the Church
Mary correctly points out that Paul viewed Adam as a type (foreshadowing) of Christ. In Romans 5 Paul specifically calls Adam “a type of the one who was to come” and in 1 Corinthians 15 he calls Christ the “last Adam.” The only other time Paul specifically refers to Adam by name is in this passage. This would seem to lend some credibility to her position.
Mary’s argument for why Eve is a type of the Church universal flows thus:
- Adam is a type of Christ (Romans 5, 1 Corinthian 15).
- The Church is described as the Bride of Christ (Ephesians 6).
- Eve was the bride of Adam (1 Timothy 2).
- Therefore Eve is a type of the Church.
Just to show that I am faithful to her logic, this is what she actually said:
We know for sure that Paul viewed Adam as a type of Christ. We also know for sure that he viewed marriage as type of the relationship between Christ and the church — in which the role of husband is a type of Christ and the role of the wife is a type of the Church. Thus, we can justifiably extrapolate that Paul also viewed Eve as a type of the Church.
Mary has just begun to swerve away from the meaning of this passage and sound interpretive principles. First, she creates an Adamic filter with Paul—anytime Paul mentions something pertaining to Adam, he must be applying a type/antitype filter relating to Christ. She appeals to an Adamic principle of interpretation to supersede the immediate context of the passage to help determine meaning. Although only Adam is mentioned in the context of the fall, Mary applies her filter to argue that Paul is making a veiled allusion to Christ. That should sound warning bells in your head.
The second indication of an interpretive problem is she uses two different typological relationships and a literal relationship to prove a third typological relationship. This does not make sense logically. She connects Eve to the Church in a typological relationship through an unrelated typological relationship between Adam and Christ.
A stronger argument for her claim (which would still be problematic) could be made from 2 Corinthians 11:2-3,
For I feel a divine jealousy for you, since I betrothed you to one husband, to present you as a pure virgin to Christ. But I am afraid that as the serpent deceived Eve by his cunning, your thoughts will be led astray from a sincere and pure devotion to Christ.
It is important to remember the difference between a comparison and a typological relationship. Typology carries with it the sense of a greater fulfillment. While we do see a much stronger relationship here between marriage, the Church, and Eve, it is still not a typological one, even less an interpretive framework for understanding other passages about Adam and Eve in the New Testament.
If this is a typological relationship, does that mean that God giving Eve to Adam as a wife was a foreshadowing of Paul presenting the Corinthian church to Christ? Was the serpent’s deception of Eve a foreshadowing of false teachers leading the church astray? Obviously not. This New Testament example is not fulfilling something that was lacking in the Old Testament, it is a comparison. Just because we can find parallels between two events, people, or things, doesn’t mean there is a typological relationship. Even less an interpretive key.
What’s Really Going on Here?
Let’s take a look at the original passage in context:
8I desire then that in every place the men should pray, lifting holy hands without anger or quarreling; 9likewise also that women should adorn themselves in respectable apparel, with modesty and self-control, not with braided hair and gold or pearls or costly attire, 10but with what is proper for women who profess godliness—with good works. 11Let a woman learn quietly with all submissiveness. 12I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet. 13For Adam was formed first, then Eve; 14and Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and became a transgressor. 15Yet she will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith and love and holiness, with self-control. (1 Timothy 2:8-15, ESV)
In context, this passage is dealing with men and women in the church. Men are specifically advised about prayer and attitudes, women about modesty and godliness. Continuing on, Paul gives more guidance on women in the church. Mary sought to avoid hashing out exactly what Paul meant here in order to focus on the last verse. I agree. The meaning of those verses is not what is at issue.
But they give us the context and in that sense they are important and deserve a few words.
In verses thirteen through fifteen Paul gives us the reason, the justification, for his statement in verses eleven and twelve. Yet these end verses also back up his whole train of thought from verse eight through twelve. He is dealing with men and women in the church. Therefore, it is most natural to take Adam and Eve in this verse as analogous to men and women, not Christ and the church. Some reasons why:
- Most tellingly, Paul has made no mention of Christ whatsoever in this passage. In the other passages (Romans 5 and 1 Corinthians 15), Paul explicitly differentiates between Adam and Christ. The only way to write Him in is to establish that Paul always considers Adam and Eve as a type of Christ and the Church. If the thought crossed his mind, it did not make it from the quill to the papyrus.
- Only two things are mentioned about Adam in this passage—he was formed first, and he was not deceived. Although these are positive (or at least not negative), the context of the story is the Genesis fall, not Christ and redemption. We have to remember that Paul is seeking to explain why he does not permit a woman to teach/exercise authority. He is not trying to clarify how she “will be saved through childbearing.” Reading Christ into this passage to explain a confusing phrase completely changes Paul’s line of reasoning for why women are not to teach/exercise authority.
- If this is really speaking about Christ, the Adam figure becomes Savior and the woman figure becomes sinner. This seems much more derogatory to women than most other interpretations of this passage, as if Adam were guiltless.
- The Eve figure is analogous to the women, since Paul is giving a basis for his determination not to let women teach/exercise authority. If it is also analogous to the Church, which is made up of men and women, why would it be used to justify denying only women the right to teach/exercise authority?
- If this really were referring to Christ and the Church we have to ask, In what way was Christ “formed” first? How was the Church “deceived and became a transgressor?” Why does Christ have to “continue in faith and love and holiness, with self-control?” How do the answers to those questions explain why Paul does not permit a woman to teach/exercise authority?
Then What Does it Mean?
I don’t pretend to be an expert on this. I’m not arguing against Mary’s approach here because I think I have a better answer. I’m arguing against it because it doesn’t fit the biblical evidence. There are much more learned people who’ve looked at these verses in Greek, compared translations, looked at the uses of “saved” in other contexts and who’ve come back with a “I think this might be what it means.” My opinion wouldn’t be any better. But just because we may not have a satisfactory alternative doesn’t mean we should settle for an unsatisfactory answer that causes more problems than it can hope to solve.
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I want to affirm once again that I see Mary as a sister in Christ. That’s primarily why I call her Mary throughout my article instead of Ms. Kassian. In the grand scheme of things, I don’t believe this passage is a major issue. Our salvation doesn’t depend on an accurate understanding of this text. And it is a good thing to hear another perspective. My concern is more over the method of interpretation than the interpretation itself.



I have often wondered if a church took “Let a woman learn quietly with all submissiveness. I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet.” literally word for word what would a woman’s role be in the local SB church?
Do you have any thoughts on this?
Tom,
I’m not sure I understand your question. Could you clarify what you’re asking?
Sorry, Andrew. My question is should women literally be quiet in church and how would this work?
Tom,
I don’t believe this is calling for women to avoid speaking at all in the church. In another challenging passage Paul talks about women prophesying in the church, so he wasn’t speaking about women being “silent”, at least not the way we normally mean “silent”.
Andrew:
My concern is that some SB would take women in silence to the extreme for total silence.
Tom,
I find those churches to be very odd. Fortunately I haven’t had much experience with them. Is it just my imagination, or do most churches that go that route also insist on everyone using the KJV too?
I, for one, believe this scripture. There are plenty of roles a woman can fill in an SBC church. She can teach other women, teach children, head missions organizations, be a church hostess….. there are numerous tasks that have to be done in order for the church to run smoothly. I do not feel the least bit slighted because I can’t serve as a deacon. My cup is full doing things for The Lord.
M.E.,
Don’t take this as an encouragement to cause a stir, but I think David Rogers has made a pretty compelling case for why women should be allowed to be deacons.
A deacon is ordained and is supposed to be a spiritual leader. A woman cannot be a spiritual leader to a man. Charles Stanley says: “To insist on ordination (of women) is to change God’s design for carrying His ministry through His church. His plan calls for distinctive roles for men and women. To alter His plan is to imply that we know better than God. The church must always guard against patterning its beliefs, policy or practices after those of the world”.
I prefer to agree with Adrian Rogers beliefs rather than his son’s.
M.E.,
In order to understand my position on deacons, you really need to also read my position on ordination. You can find that here: http://sbcimpact.org/2008/08/25/ministerial-ordination/
I understand if you don’t have the time to study this out right now, but I think it would be good, if you want to repsond, that you respond to my points from Scripture, and not just quoting what others have said or written.
Also, I am not sure whether Charles Stanley or my dad would have any serious objection to what I have written on these topics, if they were to take (or to have taken, in the case of my dad) the time to study it out. Maybe so, maybe not. I am not looking for an argument with either one. In any case, on what I consider to be the key point at stake here, whether or not women should be elders (i.e. pastors) in local congregations, and/or exercise elder-type authority over men, it seems to me we are all in agreement.
Blessings,
David
Andrew,
I haven’t been able to find the time yet to study this out to any large degree, and thus don’t have any strong opinions yet, but I thought you may be interested to know (if you didn’t already) that Watchman Nee made a big deal of Eve as a type of the church as a big part of his ecclesiology.
The most complete description of his thinking on this is found in the book The Glorious Church. His chapter on “The Type of Eve” can be found online here:
http://www.ministrybooks.org/books.cfm?id=%22%27%3FX%20
David,
I didn’t know that about Nee. I’m never quite sure how to take him.
I’m still working through the connections between Eve and the church, but I’m hesitant to say there’s a strong typological relationship in Paul’s writings, especially in this case. Yet even where typological relationships exist, the author makes a comparison and doesn’t substitute the type for the antitype. When the author speaks of a historical person and makes no reference to their antitype, I think it is best to take the author as making a reference to the historical person and not a veiled allusion to Christ (or the Church).
Andrew, In my opinion, Nee is the perfect example of an extremely diligent, sincere, and insightful student of the Word of God who could have really benefited from a course by someone like D. A. Carson on Exegetical Fallacies. Much of what you read from him needs to be taken with a grain of salt, but we should not throw out the baby with the bathwater.
Andrew,
I, too, disagree with Kassian’s approach and I concur that her interpretation is one of the least likely possible. I think Andreas Köstenberger’s is the most likely. I wonder if Kassian has read his and what she thinks about it. Here’s a link just in case you haven’t seen it either:
http://www.cbmw.org/Journal/Vol-2-No-4/Saved-Through-Childbearing
Thanks for the link. I will definitely check it out.
I finally read the article. I think his argument is strong, especially when you take it from the angle of “saved from what?” Thanks. I’ll be passing this one on.
I am big into typology but I don’t see what this prof has done as being very viable.
On a related note I looked up ‘role’ in the concordance of multiple versions of the Bible and only found one reference. Prov 26 talks about the ‘role of the wicked’. Interesting that the concept of ‘roles’ does not seem to be Biblical.
Brother Andrew,
Well done!
This section of the passage in question has its connections with order of creation, and purpose in creation ….rounding out the entire context given by the Apostle Paul. There is not a connection to any typological teaching at this point in this first letter to Timothy. The meaning is based around how we are to behave, and or use the gifts of the Spirit in the church; a view to proper edification. To extend this typologically would be a tremendous stretch, and would do harm its interpretive value.
David’s view on women functioning as deacons (servants) in the church is a subject that should be better investigated by Baptists. I like what David has said about the definition and institution of “ordination” when deacon and elders are in view. There are some important things to understand when Paul refers to one of his great servant women as a deacon…and how we tend to define that role as a means to authority for men,…and now somehow women. That is probably a good article for another day.
But to the point of your post,…and your gentle rebuke to our sister in Christ,…it is an important matter to not try to connect dots where no dots exist.
-Chris
Andrew,
Great point. It is better to stay on the trodden path of Biblical information and truth. Too many have strayed into the unknown and called it truth. When I was younger I would read God’s Word with an agenda and it took me too many different directions without the support of truth. That was scary.
One of the truths that I have picked up over the years is that much of what has been written in scripture is very difficult to place in application by command. That is so Old Testament. When I read the 10 Commandments, it reads much like 1 Timothy 2:13-15. When the 10 Commandments are summarized it comes down to loving God and loving your neighbor. How do you command that? (Hope that comes across the right way.) It seems that we have the verses in place to help us primarially to identify the character of a Spiritfilled woman, not one who is out of control necessarily. The artistry comes in how we disciple our men and preach our sermons to develop that spirit in a woman without really saying it where it sounds so commanding.
Don’t tell the women this, but, the position they have is the ideal position in God’s creation and structure. They are not the front nor the rear but the position of their influence has the greatest capacity. They make a man successful and they impact their world through their children. When we get to heaven and the glove is turned inside out we will be amazed at what we will see.
If the rule were absolue, there would be no exceptions to it. God is Sovereign over His word. It does not mean what we want it to mean; it means what He wants it to mean. Look at Jonah’s message to Nineveh. It was an unconditional prophecy of gloom and doom; there was no exception to it. The real problem is that it was given for another purpose which Jonah knew, namely, to cause the people to repent so that God would spare the city. If a prophet gives a prophecy and it is not fulfilled, he is supposed to be stoned. Jonah wanted his prophecy to be fulfilled, but he did not expect it to be fulfilled. There are exceptions to the rule of women speaking to men; they are listed as prophetesses. Cf. Matthew Poole, on ITim2….Compliments, suspect of Shubal Stearns and his sister Martha Steans Marshall.
Matthew Poole, “I suffer not a woman to teach, etc., except she be specially called, gifted, and endowed.” That was as near as I could get to a reason for Shubal Stearns and Daniel Marshall having Eldresses that could exhort the congregation in the early Sandy Creek Separate Baptist Churches. Another Puritan said much the same thing, but I failed to get his name and work down. I also found that the same language applied to women in I Cors. 14 was applied to a man who spoke in tongues, “let him keep silent.” So evidently, there was something disorderly in considertion in I Cors.14 as mention of something to the contrary was involved in I Cors.11. Besides, why make women the first witnesses to the resurrection,if their testimony was not even allowed in a court of law. And Mary Magdalene being called the Apostle to the Apostles in the early church????? Are there depths to the Scripture that our little narrow methods of study can not detect? And do we really need to adopt the idiocies of so-called critical studies, the end result of which leaves no ground for devotion, hope, etc., as Mr. Ehrman has so demonstrated by giving up his Christian Faith…He left it for unbelief precisely where I left atheism for Christ, that is, the matter of suffering and how could God allow it to happen (as in my case I argued) to children. Years later after the Third great tragedy in my life, I dream I was standing in a semi-circle around the Young Jesus in the temple (he looked like one of those pictures of a youth of 12-13, answereing the doctors of the law…He had no beard. We told him about the tragedies, and he told us how he saw them and we were laughing, a happy, healthy laughter like we had heard the only thing that could possible account for such miseries. Then I though this is the Lord. What am I doing standing here talking to Him, and I dove at His feet and at that point I woke up. Talk about regret over the awakening…and then to realize I did not know what He said about the tragedies….Someday, I expect to hear Him tell me, and I am satisfied that it will be good and right. At my mother’s funeral (along with three other members of my family from a murder suicide), I read a statement where I acknowledged that that tragedy was not the worst that had ever been. The worst of all tragedies was the crucifixion of the Lord Jesus Christ. God in His sovereignty ordained the worst of all evils in order to bring meaning and help to us in ours…along with salvation from sin. Dr. Ed Pruden who had been Harry Truman’s pastor at the FBC of Washington, DC, came to my defense, when he said he agreed with me as he did not know what he would do, if he had to bear the grief of a son who was aphixiated by a gas space heater while he was a student in college. Tha grief would be unbearable, if God did not have a hand in it to make it turn out for good…which is what I had said. The moderate students in the class were upset with my view until Dr. Pruden spoke up.
My first tragedy was the loss of my mother and father in my third year of life from divorce. My sister and I wound up being raised by our maternal grandparents. That was the suffering of a child tht I had reference to in my years as an atheist, but when Christ knocked at my heart’s door that issue completely vanished from my mind and it was years before I remembered it and wondered at the strangeness of its departure. Even now, with other tragedies, I have no doubt as to the goodness of God and His having a divine purpose in such sufferings, a divine purpose that transcends all of our ability to understand, a purpose that even knowing that you do not know it andprobably could not understand it yet brings peace to your heart.